12.25.2010

Love Your Relatives

george-yardley

On this day of being around older folks, and possibly watching basketball and/or discussing FreeDarko, here's something to ponder: Who was the first true SF? We have Frank Ramsey in the book. But a grouchy Amazon reviewer says Jim Pollard who also, like Ramsey, played next to a bigger 4. You could also make an argument for George Yardley, although he had shooting guard's game that was way ahead of its time, and size enough to play the PF.

Also, consider this an open thread for today's games, as Twitter is down. Please tell me other generational debates concerning our favorite sport! I am at home with a cat and pancakes, neither of which is much help, and my father is already in the doghouse for talking me out of putting Dick Barnett in the book.

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150 Comments:

At 12/25/2010 1:02 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Also the rare LeBron is wrong post from me on Deadspin.

Today's games are sponsored by Big Mama 3? No Billy Crystal movie to promote?

WV: aenis. Don't name your kid that.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:04 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

It would be pretty wonderful if this thread actually became crowded and twitter-like.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:06 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Isn't there something very wrong with America, or the way we think about it, if Amar'e's not an All-Star starter?

(Ask me, I'm a census expert!)

WV: cilyc = nickname for that wheat-based disorder.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:08 PM, Blogger themarkpike said...

This Mariah Carey jam is killing me.

WV: calix = my hair right now.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:08 PM, Blogger James Herbert (OTN) said...

I will to my part to keep it Twitter-like by making sure I don't go over 140 characters.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:09 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

I wonder how much money Mariah makes each year off of that song. Must be millions. Especially if there's a five-second video segment of her dressed like Santa and eating a rose.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:11 PM, Blogger FreeZarko said...

This is a great idea. Mike Wilbon looks so joyless on TV.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:11 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Will someone please tell Barry he looks like the Grinch?

Also, I find it liberating to go over 140.

Also, I'm more excited about Celtics-Magic. A Very Gilbert Christmas!

 
At 12/25/2010 1:14 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Say what you will, but LeBron is too real these days. I don't know if it's a good idea, but like Woj said, dude just says shit. Not evil. Not manipulative. Just not always the right thing, and proving that he's kind of a weird dude.

MAGIC YOU CAN'T PICK LA.

HAHA: WV = egate.

I never, ever want to see or meet Stu Scott's "buddy in Saudi Arabia".

 
At 12/25/2010 1:14 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Stu Scott has a friend in Saudi Arabia. Insert jokes around this if you are clever.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:14 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

Oddly goo point by Stu Scott: LeBron dominates Kobe in their matchups

 
At 12/25/2010 1:16 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

Agree that LeBron is too real these days. New LeBron Rule: If you're going to get mad at him, don't ask his opinion.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:20 PM, Blogger James Herbert (OTN) said...

Stu Scott just said, "If you don't like basketball, we know you do, we know you also love football." I am confused.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:20 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

I want to get mad at "but the big 3 has stayed healthy", buy C's are winning without Rondo.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:23 PM, Blogger James Herbert (OTN) said...

Anyone watching in 3D?

 
At 12/25/2010 1:24 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

I know I'm a grinch here, but the more we discuss the C's longevity, KG's miraculous return to health, the more I feel like we're about to hit a PED scandal.

That's something I wouldn't say on Twitter.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:25 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

I chose to watch Timbersports on ESPN2 and avoid Stu Scott. I do not regret this decision.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:26 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

How is Rose taking all of the Bulls shots, all the time, something to be praised ... in a point guard? The media is totally in the bag for Rose.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:26 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Something about Luol Deng succeeding really makes me happy. Perhaps it is his unassuming nature.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:27 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

If we're getting grinchy on PEDs, I'll say that I'm convinced that a significant minority of the league, say 20%, to throw out a wildly random figure, is using something. I don't care, but it almost certainly is going on.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:29 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Great moment right there - Luol on the weakside tries to set a screen for a cross-post set for Boozer, Boozer just looks at Derrick and Derrick of course drives for a crazy layup. Offense.

This comment is now out-of-date.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:30 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Amar'e plays more like a SF than ever on this team. That's the only real "without Nash" difference.

re: PEDs. This Rashard Lewis thing is fishy, and I never suspect anyone of anything.

WV: florl. Terrible name for a baby girl.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:32 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Thibs looks like Stan Van mixed with Jeff, or something. I don't know. He looks like someone. Ideas?

 
At 12/25/2010 1:33 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

This game has made me do a lot of wondering about what would have happened if STAT had signed with the Bulls. He and Rose would be totally unstoppable on P&Rs, but would Thibodeau have turned him into a good defender or died trying?

WV: methi, a way worse name for your daughter.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:35 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Boozer defends? I think Noah more than compensates.

That Spike Lee/Wade ad may be kind of boring, but it's really smart, and well-placed in the middle of major NBA games.

Nate Parham and I determined that Chris Silva looks like Landry Fields. I can't do any better than that.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:36 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

ESPN is really reliable with replays. It's like they know that otherwise, people might fall behind and skip commercials.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:37 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

On PEDs: I suspect that many guys are using HGH, but I'm not sure that's a bad thing. And I have no evidence other than a viewing of "Bigger, Faster, Stronger."

 
At 12/25/2010 1:40 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Amar'e is reminding me why I wasn't so sad to see him leave Phoenix. Boozer is having a pretty easy go of it.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:41 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

The problem with that theory is that so many guys come in so young and so big. Do we think Rose or Bron has been using PEDs since age 17?

Amar'e has actually slimmed down since the start of the year, I think.

WV: jagui = NOT ANOTHER JAG FOR CHRISTAMAS! Oh, it's the "Jag Season 3" box set? Awesome!

 
At 12/25/2010 1:42 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Also, has everyone noticed how forced the laughs are when it comes to Shaq? It isn't that funny. He was fake-conducting the Boston Pops.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:43 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

I would bet HGH use is prevalent, which I'm fine with, as the biggest benefit would be faster healing times. There are probably some 4s/5s getting some help bulking up, and the Rip Hamiltons and Ray Allens of the world would benefit from oxygen-vector drugs to help them run around screens all game long. I don't see it erupting into an ESPN moral scandal unless an MVP gets caught somehow, as the game is too era-dependent for stats to resonate like they do in baseball.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:44 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Him and Derrick Rose taking all his team's shots were made for each other.

Some "Roll Tide" dude on Twitter, from Miami, accused me of not watching the Heat games closely or providing "meaningful analysis". Don't these people understand what Deadspin is? Also someone else said it was writing as bad as music crit. Apparently their sense of irony doesn't extend past their own dicks in that comments section.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:46 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

This is a question: are some PEDs more ethical than others?

There is actually a pretty fine line between cheating and medicine. Recovery from injury is also very different from adding muscle mass.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:46 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

Gallinari has his own hot hand theory...

 
At 12/25/2010 1:49 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Okay, that Rose spin move was sick. But I still can't stand him. And I am really sick of arguing with dudes whose Twitter avatars have baseball caps about it. He's a less elegant Monta. A less unsettling Westbrook (who I also hate now). Felton is, by comparison, meat and potatoes, but I think I like him best of the three.

WV: cushi. Congrats, WV is pervy.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:49 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

On PED ethics: Some PEDs might be more ethical than others, a difficult question to parse.

On HGH: I like how it hastens healing, but HGH serves as a youth fountain because of this. If use gets widespread, it could start to feel like Groundhog Day up in here.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:50 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Fuck anti-Semitic Twitter.

WV: cring. What you do when an ill-advised three clangs out.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:52 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

I think the line between ethical and unethical, as far as PEDs, has been clouded by the negative outcry (originally stemming from baseball, of course) among the media.

Doctors probably know which is "ethical" to prescribe in particular situations. Probably.

The question is how the league decides which are unfair, etc.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:53 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Yeah, but it's never seemed fair that some kinds of players break down sooner than others, and others last forever -- always the ones we're least interested in. Also recovery is different from eternity.

It's also interesting because, while in baseball you have the eye + power, there are at least four variables that go into making a basketball play. That's why a more global "healing" seems the more important use, and also happens to be the least objectionable.

That might be why HGH would be the drug of choice, and no one cares that much. There have always been some big guys in the NBA, now there are a few more. And it's not clear that it's what makes them great, because even strength in the NBA is different than in the NBA. It's core strength, etc. Not biceps.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:53 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

I guess I'd say that all PEDs have no inherent moral valence and some situations are more ethical than others. For example, baseball, where steroids help you hit the living fuck out of the ball, is more ethically fraught than basketball, where execution is king but jumping/quickness will help you get a shot off. But it's all shades of grey anyway.

Possibly germane: an Outside Mag article from 2003 in which an amateur cyclist takes PEDs and reports on the experience. http://outsideonline.com/outside/bodywork/200311/200311_drug_test_1.html

WV: mazati. A sketchy European PED doctor.

 
At 12/25/2010 1:56 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Also complicated because basketball players as supposed to be lazy and unconcerned about anything other than coating on natural talent in the second half of the season if their team is in contention. Recreational drugs always fit that narrative better.

I mean, I guess PEDs are still lazy, but they also put competition above all. Cheating is still a form of competitiveness. No one has ever said Bonds didn't care, or was only in it for the money.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:00 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

"I mean, I guess PEDs are still lazy,[...]"

And you'll notice that players always argue that they still have to train to gain the benefits. They want you to know that they're still competing, etc.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:05 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

I hate being the Puritan here, but HGH bothers me on some level. Perhaps it's because we can't acknowledge it in our media narratives? For example, Brett Favre had the best year of his career at age 40 and we had to attribute this to 'veteran grit.' I guess I'm advocating open HGH use and muddling the argument I almost made.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:05 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Pot is still lazier.

Also, not sure if this is relevant, but the kind of/# of/degree of injuries in basketball vs. those in baseball? Come on. Really? A recovery aid is unethical when guys spend all season running around and spraining ligaments?

That would basically make anything permissible for football.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:05 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Kurt Thomas is still Kurt Thomas, it seems.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:05 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

I think my problem with Rose is that his crazy athleticism means he doesn't ever have to be creative. He just takes it to the rack or hits the dude who's wide open because the defense collapsed on him. It's pretty effective now that he's a decent shooter, but it's only shining moments are when he jumps like crazy. I don't think I've ever seen him outthink the competition.

Also, shouldn't Doris Burke and JVG be married?

 
At 12/25/2010 2:07 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Body changes and athleticism dwindles no matter what. Being structurally sound isn't the same as being able to play like you're 20 forever.

WV= pladra. Me trying to talk to Mike Prada while I'm eating a popsicle.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:08 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Derrick Rose and Amar'e get into an argument about who has the higher usage rate. They haven't heard about Basketball-Reference.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:08 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Rose has an emotion? Wow.

RJ, that's exactly it. That's why I liked that spin move. That's also why I think he hasn't had to learn how to be a point guard. Westbrook at least plays PG some, and is often straining to create despite his hops and speed.

I like when Amar'e goes up for shots without realizing he has lost the ball.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:10 PM, Blogger Chris said...

A few things --

- This little tussle is like a wreath coming together. Those colors! It is nice that Rose is showing some emotion, but it might be more of a credit to Amare's ability to get people pissed off.

- I sorta wish Rose never developed a shot, so he'd be like a jacked and shittier Rondo. Unfortunately...

- Is this the best announcing team that ESPN is going to throw up today? I really hope Mike Breen is out west for the Oklahoma City game, but I know he won't be.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:11 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

In the baseball circles I run with, it's a given that health is a skill that some players have and some don't. I guess your opinion of HGH on that front depends on if you think that's a legit difference between players or if you're willing to go to medicine to flatten that curve.

And yeah, Ethan, I think I still feel queasy about PED stuff generally because of the hypocrisy it requires. Unless it gets ok'd and is out in the open, there's going to be a disconnect between the narrative of success and effort and the more muddled truth. But given ESPN's black and white world, I don't know if you could get away with legalizing it, so everyone is more comfortable pretending it's nothing unless forced not to.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:11 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

This is off-topic, obviously, but another "Big Mama's House" movie? I'd prefer our athletes be able to openly use PEDs so we can enjoy them longer and make horrible sequels illegal, thanks.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:15 PM, Blogger katiebakes said...

Just realized that Felton's first name is not Greg, wondered why on EARTH I've been calling him Greg all season, then remembered that like four years ago at work some dude named Greg Felton embarrassed me during a meeting. My problems run deep. Good thing I watch most games alone. Word verification is "flizness" which I think is the definition of what I just described.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:15 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

See, I don't like health as a "skill" because in basketball it often seems determined by position, at least if you read "longevity" as part of the same category cluster. I keep thinking about Paul/Williams. Do we really want Williams's durability to be what decides that debate?

Also, again, I think baseball has a far more monolithic view of HEALTH. Everybody in basketball is always sort of hurt. And the number of fluke-ish serious injuries is far higher.

Tell people to head over here. I am boycotting Twitter.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:17 PM, Blogger Chris said...

Watching Fields and Amare simultaneously go up for that block on Deng was my favorite part of the game so far. Can they both get credited for the effort?

 
At 12/25/2010 2:19 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

DON'T PUT THE CAMERA ON BIG BABY IT ONLY ENCOURAGES HIM.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:20 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

I feel like Glen Davis's career goal is to become Drew Carey.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:20 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

I think we can agree that health as a skill in the NBA is pretty ridiculous.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:21 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Incidentally, I am expecting a Christmas miracle from Gil, though I might like it better if he sold his soul to the devil.


WV: cunfa. My cat's name when I get too old and fat to annunciate. Good thing I will never get fat or old.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:22 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Hey, turns out that counting on one player for you offense for the entire game and then having him sit on the bench and go cold is a great way to lose to a more balanced team.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:22 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

Go revived Knicks.

Here's how I see this thread playing out: It gets so popular that Shoals goes power mad, includes a sidebar for his wife's commentary.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:24 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

My wife is asleep.

Am I a purist? I would take Felton making things happen in transition over Rose's drives any day.

WV: anesis = a good name for a kid.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:25 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

Well, "skill" is kind of a problematic word because it implies agency for the player that doesn't exist. But it's something some players have and others don't. DWade is often injured, Roy is ruined, Andre Miller is made of rubber and steel. It is certainly true that impact on a game/season is a combo of ability and playing time, and being hurt can keep you from being useful.

Also, I have a feeling I'd be much more interested in Shoals's lady's commentary than the Sportsgal's.

WV: knusi, the Kwanzaa sprite

 
At 12/25/2010 2:26 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Also I would love to have someone ask their dad or grandpa about the first small forward.

I feel like JVG would tell it like it is about Rose's PG-ing.

Is Chandler essential? I am really into Iguodala going to the Knicks, but I wonder who they give up other than the Curry deal.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:26 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

It should be pretty obvious at this point that the Bulls have the Celtics' championship team PJ Brown-type glue guy. Now they need a Sam Cassell-type shot jacker who eventually becomes a temporary player-coach. They should go get Steve Francis from China, probably.

WV - Brohmeg. That just sounds fun.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:27 PM, Blogger Chris Towers said...

Is it a bit too Simmons-ish to compare LeBron to Kanye West? Doing shit nobody else thinks about, expanding what people think about his respective art, but consistently seems to have a startling lack of self awareness for someone so seemingly obsessed with image and icon status.

Might be a bit too obvious and lazy.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:30 PM, Blogger katiebakes said...

I will be the saddest panda if they get rid of Chandler. But I know I belong to a fan club of one.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:31 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

I guess my point is this: in baseball, getting hurt has this almost classical, tragic quality to it. In basketball, it's an occupational hazard.

Remember, nothing can prevent injuries, just make them easier to get over. Injuries aren't something we need to honor or defer to. Otherwise, what's the point of having a trainer? So Wade would still miss time. It just wouldn't ruin his, or our, season.

Again, assuming that we understood health as a constant, tormented spectrum in the NBA, as opposed to a binary.

I don't know if that means we SHOULD accept them as fate in baseball, but ailing and recovery are already a daily part of basketball. It's not like HGH introduces a totally foreign element into the process.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:33 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

Would Fields and Curry be enough to get Iggy? The real impediment, though, would be the possibility of Melo. As long as the Knicks and he are flirting with each other, there's no way they go for Iggy. If NJ pulls off the trade and talks him into extending, all bets are off, but until that happens I can't see the Knicks doing anything to clog up the 3 long term.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:35 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

@katiebakes: Aren't pandas always already kind of sad?

One more thing about injuries: in the NBA, "playing hurt" is a way of life. It's going to happen anyway.

I understand mythologizing injury-prone players, but the injury itself?

 
At 12/25/2010 2:35 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

Speaking of assumed laziness (from the PED convo), how do people feel about the "LeBron quit in the playoffs" meme?

(I'm reading the school marmish Wojnarowski piece)

 
At 12/25/2010 2:36 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Well, ailing and recovery are a daily part of baseball as well, right? It's just that we're more wary of something that heals by altering the unseen chemistry of the human body rather than a guy having to do some kind of rehab or whatever. I don't know. Make way for the future, I say!

 
At 12/25/2010 2:37 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

(I'm keeping this up top): @katiebakes: Aren't pandas always already kind of sad?

@Ethan: That meme is bullshit. LeBron was hurt. I know no one believes him any more, and SLAM didn't do itself any favors by not putting the interview online, but he told Lang this summer that he couldn't really straighten his arm, and it had been bothering him since late in the season (that's why he sat out the last game).

I place that one only slightly above the Delonte West thing.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:38 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

I guess I'm also wondering: Why is "quitting" so awful?

 
At 12/25/2010 2:39 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

@Strauss I think LeBron quitting in the playoffs is revisionist history. Whether you believe that he exaggerated the elbow injury or intentionally dogged it, I just don't buy it. He isn't that type of player.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:39 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

I don't disagree with anything you've said, Shoals, but the point to me has always been that some guys are more likely to get injured than others, and that has to be taken into account. Everybody's always kind of injured in baseball, too, as ridiculous as it seems. They play 162 games, so even though it's way lower impact, niggling things add up because there's never any time off. The point to me is that you have to take a guy's injury likeliness, insofar as it's knowable, into account in valuation. If HGH shifts this, or how much this affects his off-court time, then that matters too.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:39 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Yeah, I should never talk about baseball. I'm just saying, basketball is harder on the body and in more extreme ways. I guess pitching should be excluded from that comparison.

Twitter has also ruined the @ symbol. What does it even mean now in this context?

Does Kevin Garnett = Ray Lewis?

 
At 12/25/2010 2:41 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

(that wasn't sarcasm, I typed it before you did. I know baseball some but not that well anymore)

 
At 12/25/2010 2:41 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

I think that's the first time I've seen Shuttlesworth called for an offensive foul. Ever.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:42 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Why are the C's suddenly turning Shaq into #1 offensive option? Rondo or no, that isn't the way to win this game.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:42 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

I love how Wojnarowski asserts that "people don't like how a star like James can manage the marketing of a rival like Chris Paul" Really? What people?

Okay, this un-Twittered freedom has caused me to decadently water my anti Woj feelings. Reeling it in.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:43 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Yes, when you get into "should an injury-prone player be made invincible", I get uncomfortable.

My real point is that in basketball, you WILL get hurt. And it will wear a player down. I know this is true of baseball, but I do think it has more to do with the sport in basketball, less to do with the individual.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:43 PM, Blogger Chris Towers said...

The inconsistency with stuff like LASIK or cortisone (which is perfectly ok) surgery and HGH or PEDs (the devil) in baseball is something that bothers me.

And then the old timey guys who say things like scoffing the ball or corking your bat are simply "gamesmanship", and don't deserve the same ire as PEDs is strange also. Gaylord Perry is thought of in almost whimsical terms as a guy who's wileyness is a virtue, while Barry Bonds is a monster who singlehandedly ruined the sport.

And don't get started on the blatant inconsistencies in the media and fanbases coverage and reactions to NFL players using PEDs.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:45 PM, Blogger themarkpike said...

Can somebody make a YouTube mixtape exclusively of "saving the ball from going out of bounds" plays? Preferably mixed with musical stylings of Moombahton.

WV = brophyl: it's kind of like levitra, but for younger dudes

 
At 12/25/2010 2:47 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Did Rondo's suit come from one of the photos on the wall of the hotel in the "The Shining"?

WV= vationse. A PED you don't know about.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:48 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

Man, this sure is an announcing downgrade, huh?

Whereas, Shoals, I think that the inevitability of injury in the NBA makes it even more important whether a guy is hard to injure and quick to heal/easy to injure and slow-healing.

WV: codepigh, traditional Irish codependency.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:48 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

Good luck, themarkpike

I'm still pining for my "only rebounds" Rodman mix

 
At 12/25/2010 2:49 PM, Blogger katiebakes said...

Now that I'm thinking about it, Wilson Chandler has plenty of panda in those eyes.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:49 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

"The inconsistency with stuff like LASIK or cortisone (which is perfectly ok) surgery and HGH or PEDs (the devil) in baseball is something that bothers me."

Exactly. I think the media has helped to create a completely arbitrary line at which some medical science is acceptable and some is not. And why? Perhaps some injury prone players would see a reduction of their injuries by 75% if they started doing yoga commonly. Maybe some would stop suffering nagging injuries almost completely. Does that mean that stretching is unfair? (I know I'm being ridiculous, but I don't care)

 
At 12/25/2010 2:49 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

True story: I was best man at a friend's wedding where all the dudes in the ceremony were bought polyester brown tuxedos. Rondo could have been at that wedding.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:53 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Gawd, Celtics without Rondo do absolutely nothing for me. This is a good time to make some pancakes.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:55 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Or a grilled cheese.

Underrated storyline: Magic trying to do for Howard what Cavs should have done for LeBron last year. If only JJ Hickson had been on the table...

Open question: Will Howard be hate if he leaves? I almost feel like being a nice guy, or at least well-liked, works against you in this kind of situation.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:57 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Oh wait, that Godfocker stuff is a joke about the fact that DeNiro was in Godfather 2. I forgot that was the same actor.

 
At 12/25/2010 2:58 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

If I were a coach, I would never want to expose young players to Shaq.

WV: ditliff. Theo Ratliff + Dilbert

 
At 12/25/2010 2:59 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

I get the sense that people aren't watching this game.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:01 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

It's a game that's narratively important but has a team without its exciting catalyst against a team still learning to play together. Transcendent is unlikely to show up much. I'm watching, but to some extent because my dad's homerism is hilarious.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:01 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

I'm watching it, but not really paying attention. The internet is a distracting thing.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:03 PM, Blogger James Herbert (OTN) said...

I'm watching it while doing Christmas presents. My dad seemed intrigued and happy about his new FD book.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:03 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Speaking of injuries, this schedule is wrecked by them.

1. Bulls missing Noah.
2. Rondo out.
3. Wade not 100%
4. Nuggets sick in the soul.
5. Portland living dead.

WV: wayadd. hahaha

 
At 12/25/2010 3:04 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

I don't understand, is this Corona ad:

1. "It Ain't Me Babe"
2. "I Got You Babe"
3. "Thirteen"

 
At 12/25/2010 3:05 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

JH, ask him about small forwards.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:05 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

This Amar'e "back to the present" ad feels like a Powerade creation.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:08 PM, Blogger Ethan Sherwood Strauss said...

Pundit sez: Clearly Shoals milked an injury and quit on his thread!

 
At 12/25/2010 3:11 PM, Blogger Sos said...

Jews/non-Santa lovers, what movies are you going to see today? Also what Chinese food item are you most excited for?

1.Tron Legacy
2.Peking ravioli aka pot stikkers outside of New England.

WV-bedig, the first name of the next great slovenia sf bedig milkop

 
At 12/25/2010 3:15 PM, Blogger Chris said...

Already had some peking ravioli this afternoon! And really, Tron Legacy? You wouldn't rather watch Jeff Bridges blow a dude's brain out on our lord's birthday?

Also, this game is really not very exciting. Can I blame it on Jermaine being back?

 
At 12/25/2010 3:19 PM, Blogger arn said...

@Sos: you're making a huge mistake

Tron Legacy was so bad that I couldn't even think of a shitty enough NBA player to compare it to

 
At 12/25/2010 3:21 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Seattle Jews, if there are any others: I'm debating between the old standby, Shanghai Garden, and Seven Peppers, which I somehow only found out about this week.

Saw "True Grit" on Thursday, so likely "King's Speech", unless we're on drugs. Then it's "Tron".

WV: collsin. Slang verb that's a tribute to Nick Collison.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:22 PM, Blogger James Herbert (OTN) said...

"Dad, who was the first small forward?"
"Charles Barkley."
"He's not a small forward."
"Well, he's SMALL."


He's insane.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:22 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Also I'm not quitting on this thread, I am preparing my TED talk about Rumpulstiltskin.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:23 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Wait a minute, I forgot how old I am. I mean ask your grandfather about small forwards.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:25 PM, Blogger themarkpike said...

Technical fouls? Throwing the ball away? Sarcastic clapping? Christmas entertainment? I think I wrote a post about this.

Jewish deli in Cleveland and trying to convince the lady friend to see True Grit, but King's Speech is in the lead.

Black Swan been giving me nightmares for 2 weeks. Tron was design pr0n, but lacked in other departments.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:25 PM, Blogger Derrick said...

@Chris Towers re: LeBron/Kanye

I don't find the comparison lazy at all. I think contrast of where they come from, yet arrive at the same place in "lack of self awareness for someone so seemingly obsessed with image and icon status" is fascinating. Kanye: middle-class upbringing, fought for acceptance and validation before rising to the throne. LeBron - grew up in poverty, had the greatness label placed on him from jump (high school). It is interesting how LeBron's ride has been more difficult in both regards (1 - LBJ's road was more difficult from a socioeconomic perspective and 2) it is harder to labeled as great before actually producing as such and yet somehow live up to those lofty expectations). I guess I would expect LeBron would be more aware because since he was about 17, he's been sitting on a high perch. I said all this to say I like your comparison.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:26 PM, Blogger Sos said...

@Chris, @Arn

Tron Legacy=Turkoglu? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wiWRsSuW4iE&feature=player_embedded

 
At 12/25/2010 3:29 PM, Blogger James Herbert (OTN) said...

My dad's definitely old enough to give a better answer that the one he gave me.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:30 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Tell him to act his age.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:31 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

These games have been exceptionally sloppy. Give a joke-reason why. The more holiday-related the better.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:35 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Too much egg-nog!

 
At 12/25/2010 3:36 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

I sometimes wonder about Hubie Brown's personal life. Nothing else to add to this, really.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:36 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

Question for the room: how is the Orlando makeover going to change the team aesthetically? Clearly they're going to be playing faster, but is Gil going to own the team? Are he and Dwight going to go all buddy cop? Where does this all lead?

 
At 12/25/2010 3:37 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

@Shoals Not bad, but a bit vanilla. I say that the entire league had to help save Christmas. The documentary film will be released next year, after they edit out KG's racier moments.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:38 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Did Hubie call Marquis Daniels "heavy" or "heady"? Because either one is awesome.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:40 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Egg nog is kind of vanilla flavored!

Raise your hand if you are cooking a turkey right now!!!!!!

 
At 12/25/2010 3:41 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

No team quite discourages conversation like the Orlando Magic. Even now.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:42 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

"The Right Way" may not have won out as a style of play, but there's definitely a playbook for talking to the media.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:43 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

"The PF-C combination of Bass and Howard has to be the most bicep-iest in league history." Me, via twitter

The answer to the question about the Magicians' aesthetics always goes back to Hedo. Hedo is like Riggs in the first Lethal Weapon, but there is no Murtagh to help him deal with his problems. I'd go deeper, but if you don't get where the team is going after that analogy then you never will.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:45 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

Cliches: as safe as they are boring. LBJ may be wrong, but at least he lets you know what he thinks, I guess.

WV: almontiv. A festive almond-flavored liquor.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:46 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Why is there an octopus tentacle in this "Hoop Troop" ad?

WV= pants.

How I have waited for this day.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:48 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Jon Barry you look like Nosferatu.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:50 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

Jon Barry is secretly a Wood Elf.

They (the Wood Elves) were the ones who taught Rick Barry the secret of free throws. In exchange, Rick had to take in a bland and un-talented Wood Elf as his son.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:53 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Actually Barry looks like this:

1:26 in

 
At 12/25/2010 3:57 PM, Blogger arn said...

@Sos: Turkoglu might be a good comparison except if you were expecting Turkoglu to play like Anthony Randolph.

I went in stoned as hell expecting to throw on the 3D glasses and be in audiovisual heaven and was struggling to stay awake during the "climax" of the movie

so Bethlehem if you expect drugs to make that movie worthwhile I hope you're downing some shrooms because weed isn't enough

WV: poked- the past tense of a facebook feature that ceased to be relevant and/or fun at least 4 years ago

 
At 12/25/2010 3:58 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Kindle and paperback of Simmons, plus "When the Game Was Ours" have all passed FD on Amazon rankings ... thus proving that there are a lot of gift certificates in Boston this morning.

 
At 12/25/2010 3:58 PM, Blogger Sos said...

Sloppy play this game, maybe cuz there's 2 pagan teams playing on Xmas Day. Then again this is a pagan holiday, the head spins.

wv-oucianc, french for a small sink.

 
At 12/25/2010 4:00 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Not sure seeing that Rush Limbaugh is a bad golfer is enough humiliation to rope in "that part" of the country.

WV: porketra = orchestra made up of pork products, or cafeteria that serves only pork.

 
At 12/25/2010 4:07 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

The other half of HoopSpeak is too good for this open thread - He's on ESPN's chat. You just moved up from #2, Strauss.

 
At 12/25/2010 4:17 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

That foul put KG into his incredible hulk defense mode.

 
At 12/25/2010 4:20 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

How is this the "NBA Christmas Special"? It's just some games. That is so misleading.

 
At 12/25/2010 4:23 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

You're not wowed by small commemorative patches?

 
At 12/25/2010 4:36 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

An NBA Christmas Special would be great. Live-action or animated?

 
At 12/25/2010 4:38 PM, Blogger Bethlehem Shoals said...

Wait, you read my Christmas special suggestions, right?

 
At 12/25/2010 4:39 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

I did. But those were too individual-oriented. We need something that features key guys around the entire league. David Stern plays Santa, or something, I don't know.

 
At 12/25/2010 4:42 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

I especially enjoyed Sloan's, by the way. More jokes should be made about him, probably.

 
At 12/25/2010 4:50 PM, Blogger James Herbert (OTN) said...

Brandon Jennings called this game "boring" on Twitter and complained about the lack of Rondo. I love Brandon Jennings.

 
At 12/25/2010 4:51 PM, Blogger Rough Justice said...

What if the players' young children played a game at halftime of each game? They could bring in 8 foot rims, put the kids in uniforms and it would be like the NBA puppy bowl. Imagine if we had footage of 5-year-old Kobe bawling after losing one of those games!

 
At 12/25/2010 5:11 PM, Blogger Nick Flynt said...

The FreeDarko Open Thread experiment is almost over, with twitter back online. It was a good run. A shame though, because this game was really weird.

 
At 12/25/2010 7:08 PM, Blogger Sos said...

The FreeDarko Open Thread experiment is dead, Long Live the FreeDarko Open Thread expirment.

 
At 12/25/2010 8:51 PM, Blogger thiago said...

ah too late,
maybe next time

 
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